Hal Holbrook: From Mark Twain 'Into the Wild'

MELISSA BLOCK, host:

From NPR News, this is ALL THINGS CONSIDERED. I'm Melissa Block

MICHELE NORRIS, host:

And I'm Michele Norris.

Hollywood veteran Hal Holbrook got his first Oscar nod this year at age 84. It was a Best Supporting Actor nomination for his role in the film, "Into the Wild." Holbrook has been acting for decades. He's best known for two roles, as the anonymous source Deep Throat in "All the President's Men," even though you barely saw his face in the film - just the glow of his cigarette.

(Soundbite of movie "All the President's Men")

Mr. HAL HOLBROOK (Actor): (As Deep Throat) You tell me what you know and I'll confirm. I'll keep you in the right direction if I can, but that's all. Just follow the money.

NORRIS: And Hal Holbrook is famous for his longstanding portrayal of humorist Mark Twain.

(Soundbite of stage play)

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Mark Twain) Man is really the most interesting jackass there is.

(Soundbite of laughter)

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Mark Twain) It's his idea, you see, that the deity sits up nights to admire him.

(Soundbite of laughter)

NORRIS: When he was offered a part in the film "Into the Wild," Hal Holbrook knew the story well. He had read the tragic account of the young wilderness wanderer years before director Sean Penn ever sent him a script. Holbrook says he felt an emotional connection to 22-year-old Christopher McCandless, played in the film by actor Emile Hirsch.

Mr. HOLBROOK: I tried to climb a mountain myself all alone once without ever knowing what I was doing. I was up there four days alone. Passed out on a glacier. So, I mean, I've done a few things like that.

NORRIS: You know when you talk about climbing the mountain, I immediately thought of that scene in the film.

HOLBROOK: Yeah, they wanted - they asked me if I wanted to have a stand-in, whatever you call it, to do it for me and I said no. No, of course I don't. My Lord, I want to do myself. I see a hill or a cliff, I want to climb it. It's just part of my nature. My wife not too happy about it, but I can't help myself.

(Soundbite of laughter)

NORRIS: Well, you should - for those who have not seen this film, you should describe what we are talking about there in that scene.

Mr. HOLBROOK: Well, I picked this young man up in a - near a gas station. And asked him where he lives, and he tells me, up in the wilderness. And so I drive him up there - when he's living in a little lean-to tent. And so I'm asking him certain questions, why he's living there, and worrying a little bit about him, but this kind of relationship you don't go sticking your nose into somebody's business. You stand off man to man, you know. And then he starts running up this hill and telling me to come on up after him. And he says that I ought to change my life and get moving and do things and calling me an old man.

(Soundbite of movie "Into the Wild")

Mr. EMILE HIRSCH (Actor): (As Christopher McCandless) I mean, the core of man's spirit comes from new experiences. And there you are, a stubborn old man, sitting on your butt.

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Ron Franz) Sitting on my butt?

Mr. HIRSCH: (As Christopher McCandless) Yeah.

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Ron Franz) Ha. I will show you. Sitting on my butt.

Mr. HIRSCH: (As Christopher McCandless) What a stubborn old man.

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Ron Franz) I'll show you.

Mr. HIRSCH: (As Christopher McCandless) Come on then.

Mr. HOLBROOK: And then when I got to the top, we sit down and he tries to grab my hand; I slap it away. And we sit down and then suddenly we - the whole scene changes, and we have a very beautiful discussion.

(Soundbite of movie "Into the Wild")

Mr. HOLBROOK: (As Ron Franz) From the bits and pieces I put together, you know, from what you told me about your family, your mother and your dad. And I know you got your problems with the church, too. But there's some kind of bigger thing we can all appreciate. And it sounds like you don't mind calling it God. But when you forgive you love, and when you love, God's light shines on you.

NORRIS: I know that a lot of the people - the real people that Christopher McCandless met on his journey were involved, in some way, in the film. Did you ever get a chance to meet the real Ron Frantz, the character you played on the film?

Mr. HOLBROOK: No, no, I didn't. No, I didn't. Frankly, I don't think I really wanted to. I didn't want to model myself on anybody. I have modeled myself on characters all my life. And I've enjoyed it, but I've always had a hunger to find a role where I didn't have to characterize anybody, or I could just be myself and this was the role.

NORRIS: You know, I'd like to ask, if I can, about Mark Twain tonight. It's a role you've performed, as I understand, more than 2,000 times. And one of the things I was curious about is, since you have portrayed this character so many times in so many settings, I'm wondering how the Mark Twain that you got to know when you first took on that role differs from the Mark Twain that you've come to know decades later.

Mr. HOLBROOK: Oh well, that's good question. When you play a role this long and one that you love and one that comes easy, you can't play a role for all your life without infusing that role with the knowledge and the impressions and convictions that you acquire as you go down the road of life. And that enlarges the role and enriches the role and makes it richer and richer as the time goes by.

NORRIS: I wonder if there are cases were you're actually going through the monologue, reciting a line that you've said many times and finally - oh, my goodness, is that what he meant?

Mr. HOLBROOK: I love to swim, I love to swim. So I swim laps outside my home. And while I'm swimming I run over the material I'm going to do in the next show. And you know, so often, I'm running over something that I have done for 20, 30, maybe 40 years, and I start laughing at it. And I have to even laugh at myself. I stop at the end of the pool and I laugh at myself. But it has to do with the simple but profound truths that reside in his phrases and in his stories. I mean, phrases like, there are shoals and shoals of fools out there, running around outside the asylum, exhibiting some form of specialized insanity.

(Soundbite of laughter)

Mr. HOLBROOK: Now, I always laugh at that, that combination of words. Specialized insanity. Not just insanity, specialized insanity.

(Soundbite of laughter)

Mr. HOLBROOK: That's gorgeous.

NORRIS: Well, I should've started this conversation by saying congratulations, and I'm wondering if your name should be called out at the Academy Awards ceremony, if it will be difficult for you to restrain from reciting Mark Twain, if you're standing there on stage?

Mr. HOLBROOK: No, no, no, that wouldn't even occur me. The last thing I want anybody to think of at the Academy Awards is Mark Twain. I'm out there in a new suit of clothes in this picture. Mark Twain is something precious to me. It's my sidearm through life. I've always wanted just be an actor. Just an actor, that's all I've ever wanted to be. Play in different roles, and this is a different role for me and one I've hungered for for a long time. I'm very grateful for it. And if I, by some slim or none chance, end up - getting a chance to get up there and express my feelings on Academy Award night, I won't be referring to Mark Twain.

NORRIS: Well, Hal Holbrook, it has been a pleasure to talk to you. All the best to you, and good luck.

HOLBROOK: Thank you. Same to you, Michele.

NORRIS: You can see Hal Holbrook's portrayals of Deep Throat and Mark Twain, as well as his Oscar-nominated performance of - in "Into the Wild," at our Web site, npr.org. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright National Public Radio.